Why was the Balfour declaration adressed by letter to lord Rothschild during ww1?
and when a genocide goes too far? or are we only concerned about protests of that genocide?
@greenteakitten said in #1:
> This has nothing to do with Palestine or Israel. You make it a pro-Israel protest, same thing. People shouldn't be justifying these things so easily....
>
> www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/pro-palestinian-protestors-slash-painting-from-1914-at-university-of-cambridge/ar-BB1jz4nN
Firstly, just because something is relatively old (1914 isn't even that far back) doesn't mean it is valuable.
With that out of the way, imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
Incidentally, it is interesting that you choose to speak up against pro-Palestinian protests that "go too far" but not against the massacre of Palestinians by Israel. I suppose that isn't "going too far".
@Zurel said in #3:
> Queers for Palestine.. is like... chickens for KFC... or penguins for polar bears, or Jews for Hitler. idk. I'm not Ben Shapiro
I would think your sexual orientation is not relevant to whether or not you choose to support a genocide...
Putting the 2 million civilians living in Gaza in the same bag as the few extremists that persecute LGBT there, is exactly the kind of racist hate speech that enables genocides to happen.
And on top of that, in contrast to the propaganda spread by people who, interestingly enough, happen to often be themselves certified homophobes, Israel isn't exactly friendly towards the LQBT community either.
> This has nothing to do with Palestine or Israel. You make it a pro-Israel protest, same thing. People shouldn't be justifying these things so easily....
>
> www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/pro-palestinian-protestors-slash-painting-from-1914-at-university-of-cambridge/ar-BB1jz4nN
Firstly, just because something is relatively old (1914 isn't even that far back) doesn't mean it is valuable.
With that out of the way, imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
Incidentally, it is interesting that you choose to speak up against pro-Palestinian protests that "go too far" but not against the massacre of Palestinians by Israel. I suppose that isn't "going too far".
@Zurel said in #3:
> Queers for Palestine.. is like... chickens for KFC... or penguins for polar bears, or Jews for Hitler. idk. I'm not Ben Shapiro
I would think your sexual orientation is not relevant to whether or not you choose to support a genocide...
Putting the 2 million civilians living in Gaza in the same bag as the few extremists that persecute LGBT there, is exactly the kind of racist hate speech that enables genocides to happen.
And on top of that, in contrast to the propaganda spread by people who, interestingly enough, happen to often be themselves certified homophobes, Israel isn't exactly friendly towards the LQBT community either.
@Under-the-radar
I don’t think you read my original post. I said that anything was going too far, *including* with the roles reversed, and you even quoted that. You quoted it and then argued that I wouldn’t consider it too far.
Did I say that this thing was bad because people supported Palestine? No matter your nationality, political affiliation or anything else, destroying historical art doesn’t help your case.
Making these random pointed arguments that have nothing to do with my original post doesn’t really help anyone :)
I don’t think you read my original post. I said that anything was going too far, *including* with the roles reversed, and you even quoted that. You quoted it and then argued that I wouldn’t consider it too far.
Did I say that this thing was bad because people supported Palestine? No matter your nationality, political affiliation or anything else, destroying historical art doesn’t help your case.
Making these random pointed arguments that have nothing to do with my original post doesn’t really help anyone :)
@greenteakitten said in #14:
> I said that anything was going too far, *including* with the roles reversed, and you even quoted that. You quoted it and then argued that I wouldn’t consider it too far.
Yes, it's a very easy thing to *say*, but the fact is that you're a pro-Israeli guy, and you just so happened to choose a pro-Palestinian protest as an example of "protest that goes too far". You could very easily have found an example of protest that went too far that is not related to the Israel/ Palestine conflict. Or you could very easily have found another example of protest that went too far, where the protesters are pro-Israeli. But you didn't. Some people (possibly including myself) are bound to find that hypocritical.
@greenteakitten said in #14:
> No matter your nationality, political affiliation or anything else, destroying historical art doesn’t help your case.
Just because someone arranged some paint on some canvas 110 years ago, in such a way as representing someone's face, doesn't make it art. I note that you prudently abstained to reply to my question:
> imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
> I said that anything was going too far, *including* with the roles reversed, and you even quoted that. You quoted it and then argued that I wouldn’t consider it too far.
Yes, it's a very easy thing to *say*, but the fact is that you're a pro-Israeli guy, and you just so happened to choose a pro-Palestinian protest as an example of "protest that goes too far". You could very easily have found an example of protest that went too far that is not related to the Israel/ Palestine conflict. Or you could very easily have found another example of protest that went too far, where the protesters are pro-Israeli. But you didn't. Some people (possibly including myself) are bound to find that hypocritical.
@greenteakitten said in #14:
> No matter your nationality, political affiliation or anything else, destroying historical art doesn’t help your case.
Just because someone arranged some paint on some canvas 110 years ago, in such a way as representing someone's face, doesn't make it art. I note that you prudently abstained to reply to my question:
> imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
@Under-the-radar said in #13:
> With that out of the way, imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
No need to talk hypotetical:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w51o5Z1OgY
> With that out of the way, imagine if tomorrow Hamas ends up winning, and Yahya Sinwar, the head of Hamas, gets his portrait in some prestigious university in some Arabic country. And then in about 100 years from now, some Zionist protester tears off this portrait. Would you find that "going too far"?
No need to talk hypotetical:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w51o5Z1OgY
Londons streets have been filled with hate marches for four months, with Jews scared to even walk the streets. Our useless government should have stamped these hate marches out right at the start.. now ‘they’ve’ the bit between the teeth and now consider ‘themselves’ untouchable, a two tier policing regime has emerged.. they’re scared shitless of upsetting *them* while arresting anyone else.. a bloke got two years in jail for selling stickers whilst calls for jihad go unpunished every single week on these ‘mostly (hateful) peaceful’ marches.
@Under-the-radar said in #15:
> Yes, it's a very easy thing to *say*, but the fact is that you're a pro-Israeli guy, and you just so happened to choose a pro-Palestinian protest as an example of "protest that goes too far". You could very easily have found an example of protest that went too far that is not related to the Israel/ Palestine conflict. Or you could very easily have found another example of protest that went too far, where the protesters are pro-Israeli. But you didn't. Some people (possibly including myself) are bound to find that hypocritical.
>
I don't find it so. I made it very clear that I'm not saying this to bash Palestine.
If I wanted to bash Palestine, boy do I have lots of better choices!
Look, you choose to take it that way, that's your problem. I don't feel like explaining to people that just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they're always out for blood against your side. They might just want to discuss protests in general, and you're taking it the wrong way.
I suppose it's not so clear from my Lichess forum posts my actual stance on Israel. Either that, or you're like the others that read too fast. I've actually said things in support of Palestine before - but it seems that once someone gets so much into the "us vs. the world" mentality, they ignore that, don't they?
> Just because someone arranged some paint on some canvas 110 years ago, in such a way as representing someone's face, doesn't make it art. I note that you prudently abstained to reply to my question:
I replied to your question, maybe you missed my answer?
I already said that it would be wrong both ways.
Yeah, the British were wrong for making a double promise. Or was it a triple promise?
That's still art. You see abstract art every day, and I doubt you would tell me that wasn't art. Would you say the Mona Lisa wasn't art because it was just "paint on a canvas"?
There is no need to jump to defense. I wasn't saying Palestine was wrong, or that they were going too far and only them. All I was hoping to get was a productive discussion on protests in general and look what happens :)
If I used January 6th as an example of a protest going too far, would you jump to the defense of the MAGA people? I just happened to find this particular story in my news feed so I shared it. I would prefer if I don't get told I can't share normal news because they don't agree with other people's opinions.
> Yes, it's a very easy thing to *say*, but the fact is that you're a pro-Israeli guy, and you just so happened to choose a pro-Palestinian protest as an example of "protest that goes too far". You could very easily have found an example of protest that went too far that is not related to the Israel/ Palestine conflict. Or you could very easily have found another example of protest that went too far, where the protesters are pro-Israeli. But you didn't. Some people (possibly including myself) are bound to find that hypocritical.
>
I don't find it so. I made it very clear that I'm not saying this to bash Palestine.
If I wanted to bash Palestine, boy do I have lots of better choices!
Look, you choose to take it that way, that's your problem. I don't feel like explaining to people that just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they're always out for blood against your side. They might just want to discuss protests in general, and you're taking it the wrong way.
I suppose it's not so clear from my Lichess forum posts my actual stance on Israel. Either that, or you're like the others that read too fast. I've actually said things in support of Palestine before - but it seems that once someone gets so much into the "us vs. the world" mentality, they ignore that, don't they?
> Just because someone arranged some paint on some canvas 110 years ago, in such a way as representing someone's face, doesn't make it art. I note that you prudently abstained to reply to my question:
I replied to your question, maybe you missed my answer?
I already said that it would be wrong both ways.
Yeah, the British were wrong for making a double promise. Or was it a triple promise?
That's still art. You see abstract art every day, and I doubt you would tell me that wasn't art. Would you say the Mona Lisa wasn't art because it was just "paint on a canvas"?
There is no need to jump to defense. I wasn't saying Palestine was wrong, or that they were going too far and only them. All I was hoping to get was a productive discussion on protests in general and look what happens :)
If I used January 6th as an example of a protest going too far, would you jump to the defense of the MAGA people? I just happened to find this particular story in my news feed so I shared it. I would prefer if I don't get told I can't share normal news because they don't agree with other people's opinions.
I was exploring NYC, there were some protests about Israeli and Palestinian. Then, while they were marching they bumped into each other. So, there were gunshots, etc. Luckily, I'm an FBI Ethical Hacker in training so I get to use a pistol. But still! What are people doing these days?
@BorisOspasky said in #17:
> Londons streets have been filled with hate marches for four months, with Jews scared to even walk the streets. Our useless government should have stamped these hate marches out right at the start.. now ‘they’ve’ the bit between the teeth and now consider ‘themselves’ untouchable, a two tier policing regime has emerged.. they’re scared shitless of upsetting *them* while arresting anyone else.. a bloke got two years in jail for selling stickers whilst calls for jihad go unpunished every single week on these ‘mostly (hateful) peaceful’ marches.
The truth is that both anti-Israel/Jewish and anti-Arab/Muslim/Palestinian sentiment has come to the surface. It was always there, but the war gave everyone an excuse to show it in broad daylight.
> Londons streets have been filled with hate marches for four months, with Jews scared to even walk the streets. Our useless government should have stamped these hate marches out right at the start.. now ‘they’ve’ the bit between the teeth and now consider ‘themselves’ untouchable, a two tier policing regime has emerged.. they’re scared shitless of upsetting *them* while arresting anyone else.. a bloke got two years in jail for selling stickers whilst calls for jihad go unpunished every single week on these ‘mostly (hateful) peaceful’ marches.
The truth is that both anti-Israel/Jewish and anti-Arab/Muslim/Palestinian sentiment has come to the surface. It was always there, but the war gave everyone an excuse to show it in broad daylight.
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